Comments on: responding to Jesse’s call to “open twitter’s api” http://code-bear.com/bearlog/2009/12/20/responding-to-jesses-call-to-open-twitters-api/ Gravity is the root of lightness; stillness, the ruler of movement Sat, 10 Jul 2010 14:17:30 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.2 hourly 1 By: bear http://code-bear.com/bearlog/2009/12/20/responding-to-jesses-call-to-open-twitters-api/comment-page-1/#comment-152 bear Thu, 31 Dec 2009 05:01:13 +0000 http://code-bear.com/bearlog/2009/12/20/responding-to-jesses-call-to-open-twitters-api/#comment-152 yes! it's just like PGP key signing, the chain of trust must include one link to a service or item you trust *and* you have to be able to out-of-band verify that expression of trust is reciprocal. sounds easy but hard to do within the web framework IMO yes! it's just like PGP key signing, the chain of trust must include one link to a service or item you trust *and* you have to be able to out-of-band verify that expression of trust is reciprocal. sounds easy but hard to do within the web framework IMO

]]> By: Robin Millette http://code-bear.com/bearlog/2009/12/20/responding-to-jesses-call-to-open-twitters-api/comment-page-1/#comment-151 Robin Millette Thu, 31 Dec 2009 04:42:12 +0000 http://code-bear.com/bearlog/2009/12/20/responding-to-jesses-call-to-open-twitters-api/#comment-151 Reciprocal links, then, like google's social graph? Reciprocal links, then, like google's social graph?

]]> By: bear http://code-bear.com/bearlog/2009/12/20/responding-to-jesses-call-to-open-twitters-api/comment-page-1/#comment-150 bear Thu, 31 Dec 2009 03:40:18 +0000 http://code-bear.com/bearlog/2009/12/20/responding-to-jesses-call-to-open-twitters-api/#comment-150 that works perfectly if the aspect of trust exists - the problem with self-referential identity is that it allows for easy spoofing that looks authentic. now if rel-me pointed to some sort of signed or trusted identity profile where other items can be discovered, that would be the killer item IMO that works perfectly if the aspect of trust exists – the problem with self-referential identity is that it allows for easy spoofing that looks authentic. now if rel-me pointed to some sort of signed or trusted identity profile where other items can be discovered, that would be the killer item IMO

]]> By: Robin Millette http://code-bear.com/bearlog/2009/12/20/responding-to-jesses-call-to-open-twitters-api/comment-page-1/#comment-149 Robin Millette Wed, 30 Dec 2009 23:55:30 +0000 http://code-bear.com/bearlog/2009/12/20/responding-to-jesses-call-to-open-twitters-api/#comment-149 <a href="http://microformats.org/wiki/rel-me" rel="nofollow">http://microformats.org/wiki/rel-me</a> should be enough to say twitter julien = identica julien, no? http://microformats.org/wiki/rel-me should be enough to say twitter julien = identica julien, no?

]]> By: Julien http://code-bear.com/bearlog/2009/12/20/responding-to-jesses-call-to-open-twitters-api/comment-page-1/#comment-116 Julien Sun, 20 Dec 2009 18:19:21 +0000 http://code-bear.com/bearlog/2009/12/20/responding-to-jesses-call-to-open-twitters-api/#comment-116 Fully agree with you, once more :) For the identify, I think OAuth isn't the answer (or maybe I'm missing something). I think eventually, we will have to accept that identity cannot be enforced accross social networks and that julien on twitter may not be julien on identica. the only way we can deal with that is just provide better 'user search' apis (twitter's suck to that regard) Fully agree with you, once more :) For the identify, I think OAuth isn't the answer (or maybe I'm missing something). I think eventually, we will have to accept that identity cannot be enforced accross social networks and that julien on twitter may not be julien on identica. the only way we can deal with that is just provide better 'user search' apis (twitter's suck to that regard)

]]> By: bear http://code-bear.com/bearlog/2009/12/20/responding-to-jesses-call-to-open-twitters-api/comment-page-1/#comment-115 bear Sun, 20 Dec 2009 17:05:07 +0000 http://code-bear.com/bearlog/2009/12/20/responding-to-jesses-call-to-open-twitters-api/#comment-115 I think we are very close to being on the same page and the differences are, I hope, minor because I believe your approaching it from a<br>distribution/gateway perspective and i'm approaching it from a personal micro blog publication tool. (or at least that's how I see it right now)<br><br>Seeing it all as feeds makes perfect sense when looking at the data flow from one node to another - a feed is nothing but one form of the API that a<br>gateway would allow for retrieving information. But that also shows the problem that i'm worried about - identity. How do you maintain that when you only<br>consuming the item as a feed, even a "rich" one such as an activity stream. I think we are very close to being on the same page and the differences are, I hope, minor because I believe your approaching it from a
distribution/gateway perspective and i'm approaching it from a personal micro blog publication tool. (or at least that's how I see it right now)

Seeing it all as feeds makes perfect sense when looking at the data flow from one node to another – a feed is nothing but one form of the API that a
gateway would allow for retrieving information. But that also shows the problem that i'm worried about – identity. How do you maintain that when you only
consuming the item as a feed, even a “rich” one such as an activity stream.

]]> By: Julien http://code-bear.com/bearlog/2009/12/20/responding-to-jesses-call-to-open-twitters-api/comment-page-1/#comment-114 Julien Sun, 20 Dec 2009 16:56:43 +0000 http://code-bear.com/bearlog/2009/12/20/responding-to-jesses-call-to-open-twitters-api/#comment-114 My approach toward this : every user, whatever network they're own should be able to subscribe to any user on any service....<br><br>I haven't said anything new so far :) Any user on any service is only availbale through RSS/Atom feeds. On Twitter you're <a href="http://twitter.com/statuses/user_timeline/16133.rss" rel="nofollow">http://twitter.com/statuses/user_timeline/16133...</a>, while on your blog, you're <a href="http://code-bear.com/bearlog/feed/atom/" rel="nofollow">http://code-bear.com/bearlog/feed/atom/</a> etc...<br><br>So, for me the "open-twitter" (or rather open social network) is something that allows me subscribe to feeds. <br><br>Then, these feeds have to be "richer" then just feed/entries/link. I want activitues and more dettails about them => ActivityStreams come into the game.<br><br>The whole "push" and federation system is built via PubSubHubbub hubs. Your feeds should always tell which hub they "ping". So when I subscribe to you (your feed, wherever it is), my "social network consuming tool" (a feed reader on steroids actually... ask Loic to do that!) should be able to know where to get the data from (which hubs). It then asks the hub to ping him. <br><br>What do you think? My approach toward this : every user, whatever network they're own should be able to subscribe to any user on any service….

I haven't said anything new so far :) Any user on any service is only availbale through RSS/Atom feeds. On Twitter you're http://twitter.com/statuses/user_timeline/16133..., while on your blog, you're http://code-bear.com/bearlog/feed/atom/ etc…

So, for me the “open-twitter” (or rather open social network) is something that allows me subscribe to feeds.

Then, these feeds have to be “richer” then just feed/entries/link. I want activitues and more dettails about them => ActivityStreams come into the game.

The whole “push” and federation system is built via PubSubHubbub hubs. Your feeds should always tell which hub they “ping”. So when I subscribe to you (your feed, wherever it is), my “social network consuming tool” (a feed reader on steroids actually… ask Loic to do that!) should be able to know where to get the data from (which hubs). It then asks the hub to ping him.

What do you think?

]]> By: bear http://code-bear.com/bearlog/2009/12/20/responding-to-jesses-call-to-open-twitters-api/comment-page-1/#comment-113 bear Sun, 20 Dec 2009 16:50:37 +0000 http://code-bear.com/bearlog/2009/12/20/responding-to-jesses-call-to-open-twitters-api/#comment-113 I think I agree :) 100% with you and for sure I was doing some "hand waving" in my post because I didn't want to get into a lot of details.<br><br>But yes, receiving of the incoming post is the easy part, figuring out the intended target and any secondary sinks that may be interested in it is another concern.<br><br>My thought is that that problem is solved by the sender picking a gateway that is aware of the sender's preferred choices and knows how to broadcast to more than just the target. This allows the sender to use more than one gateway or to chain gateways depending how much, and what type of, service they provide. I think I agree :) 100% with you and for sure I was doing some “hand waving” in my post because I didn't want to get into a lot of details.

But yes, receiving of the incoming post is the easy part, figuring out the intended target and any secondary sinks that may be interested in it is another concern.

My thought is that that problem is solved by the sender picking a gateway that is aware of the sender's preferred choices and knows how to broadcast to more than just the target. This allows the sender to use more than one gateway or to chain gateways depending how much, and what type of, service they provide.

]]> By: Julien http://code-bear.com/bearlog/2009/12/20/responding-to-jesses-call-to-open-twitters-api/comment-page-1/#comment-112 Julien Sun, 20 Dec 2009 16:45:05 +0000 http://code-bear.com/bearlog/2009/12/20/responding-to-jesses-call-to-open-twitters-api/#comment-112 The problem with the Twitter API is that it's only "publishing" part... the hard (and most interesting) is by far the pubsub, broadcasting, federating part. The problem with the Twitter API is that it's only “publishing” part… the hard (and most interesting) is by far the pubsub, broadcasting, federating part.

]]> By: Julien http://code-bear.com/bearlog/2009/12/20/responding-to-jesses-call-to-open-twitters-api/comment-page-1/#comment-111 Julien Sun, 20 Dec 2009 13:19:21 +0000 http://code-bear.com/bearlog/2009/12/20/responding-to-jesses-call-to-open-twitters-api/#comment-111 Fully agree with you, once more :) For the identify, I think OAuth isn't the answer (or maybe I'm missing something). I think eventually, we will have to accept that identity cannot be enforced accross social networks and that julien on twitter may not be julien on identica. the only way we can deal with that is just provide better 'user search' apis (twitter's suck to that regard) Fully agree with you, once more :) For the identify, I think OAuth isn't the answer (or maybe I'm missing something). I think eventually, we will have to accept that identity cannot be enforced accross social networks and that julien on twitter may not be julien on identica. the only way we can deal with that is just provide better 'user search' apis (twitter's suck to that regard)

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